“You either support reproductive autonomy or you don’t.”
[This article is a transcript of “‘You either support reproductive autonomy or you don’t’” courtesy of volunteer Ben Tomlin. If you’re interested in volunteering to transcribe more of our content, please complete our volunteer survey.]
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I have to say it has been so disappointing to see some of the responses to this Lily Allen podcast where she talks about having had multiple abortions and her co-host talks about having had multiple abortions.
Jessica Valenti (@auntiekilljoy on TikTok), “We’re all indoctrinated with stigma – but we should be dismantling, not spreading it!“
So Lily Allen did a podcast where she talked about how she used to get pregnant all the time and she can’t really remember how many abortions she’s had. She thinks maybe five, four or five. And her co-host on the podcast also said that she too had had about five abortions. [See the full clip here.]
It is so upsetting to see so many responses in comments or people making videos talking about “I believe in abortion rights but this is too much” or “I’m pro-choice but.” There is no “but.”
Valenti
Examples of “such responses”I’m pro-choice but” responses to Lily Allen:
In the abortion debate, a lot of times we treat pro-choice and pro-life as if they are two totally distinct categories and you can check the box for one or check the box for the other. But in real life, I think most people actually treat it as more like a spectrum from pro-choice to pro-life, and my goal and the work of Secular Pro-Life is to constantly and continually invite people to take just a step or two away from the pro-choice end of the spectrum and toward the pro-life end of the spectrum. It is an ongoing process.
That’s why I can’t stand it when someone believes that they are pro-life and is generally opposed to abortion, but they don’t see eye to eye with pro-life activists on something like rape or fetal anomaly or one of the harder cases, and so pro-life activists say, “Well, you’re not really pro-life.” That response is pushing people away from the pro-life end of the spectrum toward the pro-choice end. I would much rather we say, “I’m so glad we agree on these areas of common ground, on the majority of abortions, and we can keep talking about these other situations.” Always inviting people closer to our end of the spectrum. But that’s also why if the pro-abortion side wants to gatekeep whether or not you really support abortion, I am all for it.
You either support reproductive autonomy or you don’t, you support someone’s right to bodily integrity or you don’t, you believe the government should interfere in people’s medical decisions or you don’t.
Valenti
Yes, more of this. Are you against someone getting five elective abortions? Then you’re not pro-choice. Are you uncomfortable with the idea that someone would abort a baby because he’s a boy? You’re not pro-choice. Do you feel horrified at the thought of aborting a healthy, viable baby? Not pro-choice.
You’re not pro-choice. You should come sit with us.
And that doesn’t mean you can’t feel your own personal feelings about a thing. We’ve all been indoctrinated with a certain level of abortion stigma.
Valenti
Activists like Valenti can’t imagine why anyone would oppose abortion or be kind of uncomfortable with abortion besides “stigma,” and I guess in a sense that’s true, because there is a lot of stigma around killing human beings.
But when you push that stigma out into the world, when you are making comments, when you are publishing videos, you are contributing to a culture that increasingly hates women.
Valenti
Are the only options a culture that hates women or a culture that loves abortion?
Feel however you want to feel about a thing. But please try to interrogate that feeling and dismantle it.
Valenti
I’m totally with her here. If the idea of someone laughingly saying they’ve had five abortions bothers you, yes, interrogate why. And when you interrogate why, if you find that some part of it is that you think prenatal children deserve a little more consideration than that, then you should follow our page and we should talk more.
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